Digital Marketing Management and Tactics – Learn PRO Tips from An Expert – feat. Paul Higgins

What Could We Learn from Paul Higgins?

Knowing Paul’s background, we imagine pages upon pages of marketing lessons. Here are some of the top takeaways we’ve gathered in Paul’s short chat with Amy and Andy in the podcast:

• Knowing your customer is always the first step in developing your marketing.
• Engagement in social media is most measured by the algorithm in comments – not likes. Post content that encourages a discussion in the comments section.
• Learn to delegate. Pick experts who can join your team and help your business scale. Peer referral is the best way to find expert team members.
• Get to know your team. Build a relationship with trust and mutual respect.
• Maximize the use of project management software. Set clear protocols on which information goes on a task and which goes on chat.
• If working remotely – take advantage of video communications. Professionals want to see who they’re working with.
• Give gratitude to the world – start your day with a grateful heart. Your attitude in the morning will influence the trajectory of your entire day.

Relationship Building in Sales and Marketing

Amy Wees: And I think it’s so important that comes back to your five priorities and that’s knowing your customer, because your customer might not be B2B. And so your customer might not be on LinkedIn. And so the importance of the content that you’re posting, whether you’re on Tik Tok, or you’re growing on Facebook, or wherever you are, it’s so important to know your customer above all other things. Because that is, you know, like, I have a friend and she’s she also does b2b services as well. She’s a coach. And she started just consistently recording on TikTok.

And when she started creating tic TOCs, there was nobody in our industry really doing anything on tick tock, but she has grown her business so much just from leads from tick tock, because she was the first one to kind of post things on there. And it’s the same thing is happening with clubhouse, I met a guy on clubhouse who started pitching, he was creating masks face masks with people’s logos on them. And he was doing this from his home. So not even print on demand, right, he was doing it from his home. And he started getting because he got laid off from his job, right. So he started getting on clubhouse and getting in these pitch rooms and pitching. And before he knew it, he had some major clients, like some big names that were in these rooms. And he just got brave and started pitching. And now he’s making face masks with logos for businesses. And he’s grown his following and now he’s like hosting clubhouse rooms and stuff like that. So I think it’s, it’s so awesome, you’ve given me some great tips for LinkedIn, and I’m going to use those. But I also think it’s so so so important to know your customer and where they’re located. And no, is that you also said something about, like, it’s all about the content that you post, you’re showcasing your knowledge, you’re showcasing who you are, right. So if you know where your customer is, and for those of you who have private label brands, yeah, that’s where it wherever your customer hangs out, that’s where you should be like, I’m in the cat business, you know, I have a pet brand. So I need to be posting where the cat people are hanging out. Right. And I need to be showcasing my authority and drawing those people to my brand in that way. Right?

Paul Higgins: Yeah. And the principles apply, you know, in that case, you know, with LinkedIn, it’s, you know, your profile. So it might be a website, as an example, then you’re putting out really good content. The great thing with LinkedIn is that it’s free, and it’s organic, it’s still the last best thing of that. So you know, I can literally take 15 minutes to do a post and get 100,000 views, right, and engagement and clients off it and it didn’t cost me a cent. So I think that’s great. And then the last one is a possibility. So when you do tap someone on the shoulder, so you know, you could do that on any platform could be Instagram, it could be clubhouse, whatever, when you’re reaching out to someone isn’t a great if you can actually say well, you know, thanks for commenting on this particular topic. That’s a lovely way because I’ve already like liked well, most certainly seen your content. They’ve looked at your profile, if they’ve looked at your posts. And then when you reach out to them, it’s not cold, right, it’s more warm. And the third thing with LinkedIn is that possibilities of reaching out. And I think there’s a lot of people that you know, just send spam, I think we all you know, receive that. But I think if you can link it to the other two, or then it becomes really powerful.

Amy: And let’s shift over to that last element that you talked about creating a team so that we’re not just creating a job for ourselves. So how do we pick the right experts so that we can remove some of these hats that we wear?

Paul: Yeah, look it, you know, from for me personally, it was one of the hardest things I found when I left Coca Cola because, you know, Coke. You know, we just attracted really great experts. So we had the best people in the world. And I was just used to hiring someone, and they would get the job done. I went into my own business and I thought it’d be the same and I got burned on several occasions. And I’m talking huge amounts of money. You know, one in particular was a grant based business where I went and got a grant for exporting everything was fine. The tax department called me and said Are there the company that you used, has gone into receivership. We need now to audit all of your findings and your work on my book on don’t have it, I’ve got it. And I said, well, sorry, if you can’t do that, by the end of the week, we’re going to ask you to pay us back all the money plus interest. So you know that that was effectively like a, you know, my wage for my family for the year. And so one thing I think, is peer referrals really important, just don’t go by face value. So, you know, we’ve got 400 vetted experts around the world, when someone says, Hey, I need an econ expert, I go, well, here, these are the people that you go to. So I’ve collected that now because of my own experience, but I think tap in to your networks to get that, you know, I think often experts, in particular in the marketing area are brilliant at marketing themselves. But that doesn’t always mean they’re great in delivering a product. So I think peer referral is, I think one of the best ways to find experts.

Amy: One of the things that I learned from from Andy works with a really cool mentor named Dan Martell, and he introduced me to his work as well. And one thing that I learned on that was to really you know, that your website is your 24/7 sales page. And it’s one of the most important things that you can build to represent yourself. And you wouldn’t believe how many marketing experts or supposedly experts will reach out to you not only on Facebook, but on LinkedIn. So my little hack to, to kind of vet them, as I say, Well, go ahead, and it’s great that you reached out to me, go ahead and send me your website, I’ll contact you, if I’m interested. Thanks. And most of them, many of them do not have a website, or if they do have one, it’s very poorly done. And so I just, I use that as like my initial vetting point, and then I agree with you 100%. And getting those referrals is so so so important. Because yeah, I think all of us have been burned and what you said about, you left your job, and you just expected to be able to hire people, you know, you manage people in your job, and everything was fine. And I kind of have the same expectation, I left my, you know, job and working for government and I had managed many teams for many years. And I thought this will be fine. You know, but there was a lot of that. So one of the hardest hurdles for me to overcome was a remote team was running a remote team. So can you give us some tips on how to run how to effectively run a remote team?

Paul: Yeah, and I suppose with a coke company, I was sort of part of the remote team for all of my career, because, you know, whether it was by state, whether it’s by country, I did a lot of work with other countries around the world, because that was a bit of a code company is that, you know, they shared their knowledge brilliantly, because, you know, most problems that came up, someone else had already come across them. Right. So we were sort of in a culture of they use it to say, Think global act local. I think the same applies with your remote team that, you know, the first thing I think, is the culture. Right? So no matter whether someone’s working for you, directly, or there are specialists within your team, I think it’s it’s really important to set up that culture like, you know, how, how do you work? What, what are your principles? Now? I call them guiding principles, what are the things that are important? What are your values? What are your behaviors? You know? What are the your routines and rituals, I think they’re the things that you need to set up upfront. So everyone sort of knows, collectively, you know, how we’re going to work. Okay, so that’s not saying that individuals can’t be individuals, but as a team, you know, what about what’s our playbook here? Well, what’s our rules? So I think setting up that culture and you as a leader, leaving that culture, I think is really important from the outset, I think the next one is around asynchronous communication, I think, you know, it’s great to have live calls and it’s great to, you know, get on Zoom, etc. But I think also the power of, of leaving messages, giving someone the time to think about it and reply, so, you know, yes, there was email now, it’s a lot more effective. So we use Voxer. But there’s WhatsApp, there’s, you know, other other forms of communication. That’s a synchronous, so I think that’s really important. The other one is getting to know the person really well. Okay. So, you know, it’s often easy to be a little bit more rude removed, because it’s remote. But I have a little file and every you know, I asked my team. Firstly, when someone comes onto my team, I ask all about them. So you know, what are your passions in life? You know, you know your family. Tell me a little bit about your family. You know those things So I’m getting to know the person. And then I’ve got a little file that each time someone says something about their family or whatever I sort of collect, collect that information. So I’m actually asking them about those things. Because I think it’s easy being remote to sort of say, well, you know, it’s more just about work, whereas no people are people. And I think you’ve still got to build that relationship with the team.

Amy: Yeah, I absolutely love that. Paul, in the thing. You know, one of the I don’t know what tools you use, but like, I’m always trying new tools, right. I’m a software guy. But I feel like once, you know, I used to use Skype. And then I tried like, Trello. And, you know, finally, I’ve landed at, you know, my absolute favorite for, you know, coordination is slack. And, you know, I’ve heard the hype for years, and I tried it the first time. And this happens for a lot of tools, right? You’ll try for the first time and you’d be like, I just, I don’t get this. But then when you actually take some time to like, really dig into it. I mean, Slack is absolutely amazing. You know, my productivity and my communication with my team has gone up so much, since we’ve, you know, taken that on. And when you combine that with things like Zapier, you know that automation goes to the next level, I’m like I said, I’m a software automation guy. So anything that I can do, that lets me automate tasks I absolutely love. And if you combine that with a VA and with you know, virtual employees, and you’re talking and going to the next level right now, you’re it’s almost like cloning yourself. So I absolutely love that. And everybody knows that we’ve talked about airtable a bunch, you know, like I said, that’s another one of my favorites. Any other tools that you use to keep your your team synched up? Maybe Google Drive is a you know, another one we use a lot?

Amy: Yeah, look, I think you’ve mentioned some great ones here. And actually, we had a tech consulting business. So you know, when I was advising to small business owners, I saw two big gaps, and they were really the company’s strengths. Right? It was, how do you leverage technology? How do you leverage people pretty simple. So I set up an outsourcing business, and we set up a tech consulting business. So we advise agencies all around the world on what tech they should use. And you know, if I look at the core suite, I think you nailed it with a project management software doesn’t matter which one, right? We prefer Asana doesn’t matter if it’s click ups, another great one at the moment, Trello, it doesn’t really matter. But I really think that there should be a divide between when you’re communicating with someone versus when you’re setting a task, right? I think that is really important. Because a lot of things get missed, because you know, in Slack, it’s a great tool, but it can get overwhelming, right? It’s no different than email, where what I like is if you’re going to tasked me to do something I won’t ever read an notification refused to write, it’s because it’s too much noise. But what I will do is, if you tasked me and Mark at high, medium or low, I will do that, right. So I think no matter what project management software you use, I think they’re really important. Make sure that you’re very clear on what goes in a chat like a Slack, WhatsApp, or a Voxer versus what goes in Asana as a task. So I think that’s one key thing. The other one you mentioned is, you know, you know, cloud based documents, you know, we’re a Google through and through. So I think that’s brilliant for a small business. You know, as soon as I left Coke, I decided never work with Microsoft, again, even though Microsoft on LinkedIn, but I think that’s really important. And you know, with that just have clear structures of where things go, you know, because search is brilliant. But I think, you know, naming files, like, you know, it’s, it sounds a simple thing. But if you have a naming protocol, then it’s really easy for people to find stuff. Because just think, how often do you waste time trying to find things. And when you’re naming things now, because I read lead teams of 200, people, etc. In the past, always set it up, like what happens? How’s all of these 200 people going to find it, even if you’re one, by the time you get a VA excetera onboard and build a team. If you’ve started that practice from the start, it’s going to make it so much easier when you bring a team in. So I think those naming protocols is really important. As I said before, I think you should have a dedicated sales CRM, we use copper, which integrates into Gmail beautifully. So coppers sales CRM, so I think, you know, it’s important to have that, I think, you know, EComm, you know, maybe different but I think that and then I think the other key one is, you know, around a video these days, I think video is so powerful. Make sure you’ve got a video tool in your arsenal. So we use dub, it’s the you double B. And you know, that’s fantastic for me on LinkedIn, I send video messages rather than text based so people know me, I’ll bring up their profile, but you know, the power of video to your team to consumers. So you know, there’s lots of great platforms out there, but make sure you have a video platform that makes it really easy for you.

Amy: Yeah, absolutely love that. And and what people don’t realize is they want to see the face and the team behind the product, right? I mean, they want to know and trust you, you know, you can see all you want on your sales copy page. But you know if if they get on and and they go, Oh, I don’t know about that guy, they’re not going to do business with you. I feel like, Yeah, I mean, one of the you almost never see that on LinkedIn, I actually laugh as a marketer, when I get these automated messages, which, you know, everybody gets on LinkedIn like crazy. And my wife who’s a real estate agent, you know, I told her, You got to start really investing on LinkedIn. And, you know, I’ve told lots of other people this because it’s so underutilized. And so that mean, the amount of traction you get on LinkedIn is what Facebook was in the beginning, right, the organic traffic and the views and things like that. And like you said, the connections that you make there, though, you know, it’s it’s a big level up from most, I would say, it’s probably equivalent to, you know, everyone’s talking clubhouse, I would say LinkedIn has been clubhouse for years, you know, like, I mean, I’ve reached out to some really big names, and they’ll actually message me back and have a conversation with me. You know, which is crazy that people aren’t, you know, utilizing it. For me, it was a blessing. You know, I’ve been banned from Facebook, I think two or three times now. And so during that time, you know, first time I was frustrated, upset, you know, second time, I was like, you know, what, I’ve been here, you know, kind of like your whole thing with Microsoft, I’ve felt the same with Facebook, I’m back on Facebook now. But it literally gets, you know, it’s like my secondary or third, you know, it’s like on the backburner now, but I’m so grateful looking back on it, because it made me start digging into LinkedIn. And once I started digging, digging into LinkedIn, and seeing how it worked, I was able to grow a fairly big audience there. And I get so much more interaction, and the people that I interact with are actually my customers. You know, which is, which is crazy, because I’m a b2b business. So that’s, that’s a lot. That’s a great tip. And a lot of people don’t know that you can actually send video over LinkedIn messages, which is awesome. You know, you could say, Hey, Paul, this is Andy, you know, I’ve got some new software that you might be interested, here’s a quick demo, you know, if you’re interested here, you know, here’s the thing to book a call with me, you know, if you’re not interested in no problem, if there’s any way I can, you know, help you or connect you with other people on LinkedIn, I’m totally willing, you know, that’s what people want, they want that, especially in these times where people are locked inside all day long. They want that more human, you know, interaction. And these, you know, spam messages, whatever it is, it’s hilarious, they’ll send the spam message with the link to their website, and then like a Calendly link. And it’s so funny, because as soon as I open that message, I click the Close. But you know, if somebody messages me, and like, Hey, I’d love to connect, like, what are you up to today? Like, even something that simple, I’m like, okay, more, you know, that’s more of a human or human interaction, they might try to sell me after I accept the connection. But you know, to me, that’s a much better tactic. And, you know, people really need to learn that marketing is going a different way now, right? It’s like you said, you know, Gary Vee pioneered it. And I think that that’s where it is now is, is a permission based marketing, but the value has to be given up front, for people to know and trust you, and then you can start saying, Hey, by the way, I have this thing that’s gonna make your life better. You know, and that’s, that’s the other thing is, is making people know, like, it’s easy to sell something when you know, it’s gonna make their life better, right? So are a few elements that people are missing.

Paul: And I think there’s some great points there. And you know, for me, I think you hit the nail on the head, you know, permission when you’re outreaching. Permission is critical. And there’s one word I use on LinkedIn than any other. And you know, when I’m reaching out to people, and it’s a simple word, it’s open. Are you open to connecting? Are you open to having a call, always ask permission by using the word open? Right? It gives them the power of making the choice. And you know, that alone will differentiate you from everyone else that is making an assumption. It’s not permission. They’re saying, I assume you’re this No, you’ve got to find out what someone is and, and, you know, video is so powerful in that way. And, you know, what I love is that so with dub, you can actually just link the video straight into the messenger. But what I’ll often do is also, if they’ve got their correct email address in the contacts, I’ll have their profile up, but I’ll send it an email. But the ultimate goal on I think social is really there to build the audience build the connection, right? The ultimate goal for me is you sell on your list. Right, and I think so many people get that the wrong way around. They try to sell on LinkedIn. Right? For me, what I want to do is build a relationship 3% of people are ready to buy from me at any one time, right? So why would I treat their 97 like the three so what I want to do is get people from On LinkedIn, which you don’t own, it’s basically you, you know, to use your wife’s analogy, Andy, you know, it’s, it’s building on someone else’s land, move them across to your list, and then you can build a relationship and then sell to them on the list. And I think that’s the so video and open gives you the permission to do that to build the relationship and then get them on your list and sell on your list.

Amy: Yeah, absolutely. And then you know that the other thing, you know, is, is giving the value upfront, you know, and not, you know, just sending them to a Click Funnels page to say, hey, click here to buy on your first interaction, you know, the chances of that are very low, and it’s just gonna piss people off. Really, they’re just, you know, not going to want to deal with you. So, yeah, we talked a lot about, you know, systems and work flexibility. One of the things that, you know, I would love, or something I’d love for you to do is, you know, go through a day in Paul’s life in terms of, you know, getting up in the morning interacting with your team, you know, because that’s one thing. I think that a lot of people hear that, but they don’t know how to actually put that into practice.

Paul: Yeah, so. So, you know, I get up because America, and I’m in Australia, American time I get up, you know, 530, most mornings. And what I’ll do first is my stretches. So I’ve got a routine of that, then I come in. And normally I’ve got an interview or a client meeting or a sales call early in the morning. But soon as I get out of those, I leave a Vox message to my to my team of Voxer message saying, You know what my biggest win was for the day prior, what the key thing that I’m focusing on for today, and what I need help on, and then my team, whenever they get onto their timezone in the morning, they do the same, the same thing. So I think that’s a great Why have you know, yes, we might talk physically during the day, but we’ve set that up. So doing that I think is really important. I do my biggest tasks in the morning. And then I get to my tasks late. So I say to my team, if you want me to specifically do something that’s urgent, vocs me, because the Voxer is my you know, like SMS, I’ll always answer that. But I may not get to my, to my TAs, I have someone that screens all of my emails, so I don’t open my inbox at all. I’ll go, what they’ll do is either answer it for me, or what they’ll do is if there’s something specific or do they’ll task me in Asana, so then I’ll go back. And just quickly on the middle of the day, I normally ride my bike habits swim, the most important thing I do in my life is have a 30 minute nap every day. So it’s normally seven minutes of meditation, 30 minutes sleep, so that sort of in recharges me I gave a cold shower, and then I work on the back half of my day. So that’s a bit of a summary of what I do. And then at the end of the day, always have a daily reflection. Now what will my key wins for the day? What a couple of my key challenges, and most importantly, you know, grateful, you know, what was I grateful for that day, but also how did I create a grateful gesture in someone else’s life in that day, and then that’s it.

Andy:  I love that poll. And one of the things that I’ve really, really been trying hard on it and I find makes a huge difference in my life. So I encourage everyone to do that is the exact same thing is, you know, just give gratitude to the world. You know, as bad as your day is, you know, like this morning. Like I said, I have three kids taking my kids to school this morning was a nightmare. But on the way to school, you know, about five minutes before we got to school, I told my kids Hey, today you get to choose before you step out of this car, how your day is gonna be is it gonna be a good day is gonna be a bad day. You know, you get to choose that. And I really hope that you choose, it’s going to be a good day. And then I asked each of my kids like so you know, one of my kids name is Archie, Archie, how’s your day gonna be? Well, it’s gonna be alright. I said, All right, really? You just want it to be all right, should it be a great day. And, you know, I’m really trying to coach them on that. Because when you start that day with a positive mindset, it really kind of, you know, molds your, you know, if nobody’s seen the secret or whatever. A lot of people think that’s hokey, but you know, there’s a lot of truth to manifesting, you know, all kinds of things, you know, when you speak it out loud when you, you know, think it things like that, and it can also work against you, right? If you get up and you’re like, I hate my life, I have so much to do today, you know, you know, I don’t have enough money, I hate my job, you know, then that’s your, that’s the theme of your whole day. So that’s something we’ve been, I’ve been really trying hard to do myself. The other thing is, you know, you also like nowadays there’s so much media, right? We consume so much every day of information. And you know, I used to like every day like you know, marketing and you know, all stuff like really business related. And then I realized, you know, that’s just jumbling up my brain, you know, like so a lot of things now is I’m listening to People who are just positive mindset like, you know, once again, like Tony Robbins, you know, because I feel like if you get to that positive mindset, then all that other stuff comes so much more naturally. And you really get clarity on what you need to do next. So, I absolutely love that routine fall. The other thing I’ve been getting back into, which makes a huge, huge difference is just moving your body right working out and go to the gym, eating, you know, much, much more healthy fasting, all the things that, you know, you hear and you’re like, plan, I’ll do that someday, you know, when this when X, Y, or Z isn’t here, I’ll you know, get to that. But you know, that makes a big difference. But everybody listening today, you know, if you want to start with one thing, I say start with the positive mindset in the morning, you know, if you’re like, me, unfortunately, Paul, I’m a little jealous of the, you know, being able to meditate stuff. I always laugh, I kind of laugh when people say that I’m like, you don’t have three kids do you?

Paul: Know, the thing that changed my life with meditation was like, it can be while you’re active. Right? So when I’m riding my bike, I’m gonna meditate. Absolutely, yeah. When I’m swimming, you know, I count the bubbles. And I, and you know, thoughts always gonna come in your head, right? That’s where meaning making machines, but if you just acknowledged the thought, and then just going back to focusing on the bubbles in the pool, that’s a form of meditation. So you don’t always have to be still.

Andy: Yeah, no, absolutely, yeah. And what I’ve been doing lately is exactly that, you know, I’ll just at night, you know, I’m usually working after the kids go to bed. And, you know, I’ve been lately just putting my laptop aside, sitting on the ground, you know, with my back against the couch, and just kind of closing my eyes and, you know, picturing, you know, you know, positive things or or, you know, goals or you know, things like that, or just nothing at all, just clearing your mind, you know? So those are those are great points. All right, this is the other thing I’d love to ask Paul. Because, once again, I, you know, I used to listen to to probably an audio book, every, you know, day or two, I used to commute for quite a while back when I was working the nine to five, which is quite a long time ago now. But, you know, any media, you know, podcasts, YouTube channels are books, anything that you’re really into right now that you feel like has made a big impact in your life.

Paul: Yeah, look, I’ve got a core set of podcasts that I listen to every day. So yes, I’m a podcaster. But I’m also a podcast junkie. And I listen to two and a half to three times speed. And I consume quite a lot of content, but some of my favorites. So there’s a guy called James Schramko, from SuperFastBusiness, a regular listener of his Pat Flynn, or listen to his there’s a guy Ari Mizel, who unfortunately, is going to close his podcast soon. But I always listened to his there’s growth experts from Dennis, I listened to that, and also Marketing School by a past guest of yours, as you mentioned. So that’s great. And then Then I’ve got on the weekends, then I listen to things. Like I think it’s called intelligence square, which is a great podcast, where they have intellectual debates on, you know, on different topics. And then I listen to a lot of American history. You know, I grew up in Australia, most of my clients now are in North America, particularly America. So I want to understand as much of your history as possible. So I spend a lot of time listening to American history. And I suppose what’s interesting is to go back that I know, it’s been very turbulent. But I don’t think it’s been the only time that in American history that there’s been a bit of turbulence.

Andy: Yeah, absolutely. I think that we’ve right. You know, my wife and I were talking about this the other night is, you know, for quite a few years now, I mean, we’ve just been, you know, we’re just posh here, right? We’re watching our Netflix, where, you know, if our DoorDash guy is late, we throw a fit, right? I mean, it’s like, putting it into perspective. I mean, you know, how many of us that are still alive, you know, ran into a spray of bullets from German soldiers, right? I mean, that’s, you know, it’s crazy to me that, that, yeah, we’re spoiled. We’re absolutely spoiled. And, you know, we hit our kids are spoiled, and we are trying really hard once again, to make them aware of, you know, we, you need to be grateful for what you have, in terms of, you know, humanity, like, yes, there’s lots of problems now, but the kinds of problems that we have now pale in comparison to, you know, even even 20 years ago, you know, the things that we have now, the way that we can get business, the way that we can earn money, the way that we can provide, you know, the the safety, the security, I mean, you know, even though like you said, it’s been a little tumultuous lately, you know, it’s still, you know, easy, quote unquote easy

Paul: A new talked about media, I think just, you know, for me, I was always on a plane for work. So often I was away from my family all over the world. You know, one of the fundamental reasons I left corporate I was my health, but the other was to take my kids around the world. So I traveled with them, we used to go away minimum one time, a year, sometimes, you know, we went to Europe for eight weeks as an example, and show them how other people live. You know, because we are in a bit of a bubble here as well, it’s a great place to live in Melbourne, before Corona was voted the most livable city in the world. So it is a great place I taking them to countries like the Philippines, South Africa, places where, you know, they’re 20 year old kids. And I interviewed someone yesterday said her goal was to go from a one bedroom to a two bedroom to ultimately, you know, owning the land, that their houses aren’t very different to what my children at 19 and 16. You know, their goals in life?

Andy: Yeah, absolutely. And, and the dynamic is changing. And, you know, my hope is, you know, that we come back to the middle, right? It’s so at least in America, you’re saying, you know, right now it’s so polarized. But when you really sit two people down in a room and ask them what’s important, you know, they’ll probably agree on 80% of the issues, right? And unfortunately, my hope is that, you know, in a lot of other democracies, there’s more than two parties right here, there’s two parties. And so when you have two opposing forces, you know, intrinsically there’s going to be that’s going to escalate, right? It’s like putting two armies on each side of a border, right? I mean, it’s always going to get worse before it gets better. Unless you bring in a third, you know, party that’s like, hey, wait a minute, guys, you have a really good idea with that this is a really good idea. From there. Let’s put that together. And let’s make this work. And let’s compromise. And, you know, that’s what we used to do here. But unfortunately, you know, people are digging their heels in rather than, you know, actually sitting down and listening to each other. So, anyway, that’s a whole nother podcast. But Paul, thank you so much for being on I really enjoyed our time together. Let people know where they can find you.

Paul: Yes. So the key site to go to is Paul Higgins. mentoring.com. So that’s where I’ve got my podcast, my book. And then there’s also where my products are, is build live gear. But if you go to Paul Higgins, mentoring.com, it takes you to everywhere else. And I’ll make sure that my team send you guys the links that I’ve mentioned, as well in the podcast, where there’s some resources that I hope gives you value.

Amy: Awesome, thank you again, Paul. Really appreciate it. Alright, guys, if you didn’t know we do this every Tuesday at 1pm Pacific Time, we do that for a reason. You know, it’s kind of hard sometimes for me and I to get here, you know, every day at that time undisturbed. But the reason we do it is because we really love for you guys to join us live, to interact with people like Paul where you get to ask him questions, we get a lot of people on where if you tried to call them on the phone and ask them questions, they charge you, you know, an ungodly amount of money. So please join us live in the Zoom call. We really love having you guys here we have, you know, some regulars we really appreciate you guys, that you guys are always in here. Thank you so much for that. And if you can’t catch us live as usual, we’re on every major podcast platform. Please rate review, subscribe. We really appreciate that guys, we continue to grow and we love to get to as many people as possible to help them. And if you ever want to reach out with a guest idea or request on something we should cover, please do that. Andy at seller seo.com Is my direct email. Thank you guys so much for being here. And we’ll see you next time on the seller roundtable.

Andy: Thanks for tuning in. Join us every Tuesday at 1pm Pacific Standard Time for live q&a And bonus content after the recording at seller roundtable.com sponsored by the ultimate software tool for Amazon sales and growth seller seo.com and amazing@home.com